CD PRESENTATION

EC-When was the first time you saw George Reeves and what did he do for you to become such a loyal fan?

LK- The first time I saw George was of course on the Superman TV show, sometime around 1960-61, WPIX channel 11 in the Metropolitan New York area. It didn’t register to me what his name was, he just seemed like a really neat person. He made you feel like you were his good friend. After watching a couple of episodes, I did want to know who he was. I remember asking my father his name and he said “George Reeves.” The words that followed had an unfamiliar meaning, which had a mysterious tone to it. I was five years old and it was probably the first time I’d heard of death. I never really found out how my father knew who George was. Years later, after my own father passed away, did I make the connection that they both served in the Army Air Corp. My Dad must have seen George in one of those government films. Anyway, unlike so many other fans of the show I never really had that feeling “of Superman patrolling the skies” to keep me safe nor was in awe that I was seeing the real Superman. I did, like so many others, run around the house with a towel around my neck. In one visit to my Aunt’s house, I remember trying to get her to tuck the towel into my shirt neck opening like George’s, not tied around my neck with a knot in the front. So, she employed safety pins to secure it into place. LOL. Once I connected a name to this man, to me the real identity of this person was George Reeves. And from reading the comic books George Reeves’ name was not included in the stories. So, I knew there was a big difference between the two. However, being there was a live version of Superman, he was in my mind (in comparison to the comic books) the closest we would see a Superman.  This is just my opinion. There have been great actors that played Superman, but George remains at the top. I admired the Superman in the comic books, then most notably drawn by Curt Swan. But the two were logistically different, but similar in some hinted ways. Of the two versions, George Reeves won the part.

EC-When did you start doing research on George Reeves to find out everything about him?

LK- Research to me is defined by going out and talking to the people involved. Like visiting places and discovering something unknown or maybe confirming an issue. I was always searching for old newspapers and articles to piece together facts about a life I wanted to know more about. Then there’s learning which, is information obtained from the research of others. Such as reading Gary Grossman’s book, Superman: Serial to Cereal. A great title by the way. Learning new things from Jan Alan Henderson’s Speeding Bullet: The Life and Bizarre Death of George Reeves. Gosh, the Merrill Sparks insight was a real eye opener. Why didn’t he come forward on June 17, 1959? I guess we will never know.

I’ve spoken to Jack Larson, Noel Neill, Robert Rockwell, Dabbs Greer, Jeff Corey, Keith Thibodeaux, and Joanne Siegel, the wife of Jerry Siegel co-creator of the Superman character. I’ve walked away with various bits of knowledge from each of them. In doing so, I got to understand George Reeves the person, a little better with each conversation. I’ve also been inside the house that was once occupied by George. I discovered the correct location of the master bedroom. In all the writings and TV segments to that point, it never made sense to me as it was described above the garage and finally I was able to satisfy my own curiosity (it’s above the living room).  As a result I made it highly known to everyone interested what was correct. I eventually created a layout of the house for the TAC site to help satisfy the extremely curious fan base and give future authors and producers a reference.

In addition, a number of times I went to college libraries, other than the ones I attended and found they had years and years of newspapers saved on microfiche. I gathered a lot of articles relative to George’s untimely death. As a result of gathering this information. I’ve been able to step back in time to read first hand the chain of events as it occurred. Now while not everything you read is the truth, it takes a lot of time cross-referencing with folks with this interest to sort out what is or isn’t logical. But just because something doesn’t seem logical, that doesn’t mean it’s not the truth. Truth comes in all forms.

EC-What made you decide to do “Saving George Reeves” and what was your intention while making it?

LK- It has really been about the fans getting as much on George as possible. I realized after several years of collecting and reading everything and anything published, I realized I had a lot of photos and articles that by 2002 were never before published. Initially, the material was meant for The Adventures Continue #17. Because of the Internet and less than moderate sales of #16, Jim had announced this would be the last issue. I hoped to convince him to do another. What I had to offer would have easily filled up an entire issue. When I showed a number of these items to Jim Nolt, he even took a moment to give it some consideration. By 2001, the TAC web site was now six or seven years old and many more people were turning to the Internet for their George Reeves and Superman interest. So with the TAC fanzine no longer a viable channel, I decided to do my own thing. While a book would be the ultimate tribute, I felt the quickest way to reach the fans was to create a presentation using the Power Point program. I also felt while it’s great to read about George’s life in various modern day biographies. I think the fans get more out of this interest by reading first hand those rare and hard to find articles that were used as resources. For example, we’ve read that George appeared in Winged Victory in 1943 and one or two points of information is told. Then I found this really extraordinary article titled G.I. Greasepaint which I felt the fans would love to read. It has a lot of information and wonderful photos with George and his wife Ellanora and their experience together in this Moss Hart production. I figured if I could gather a lot of what I thought was unique and make it available the fans would have a greater appreciation for the subject. Superman’s Girl Friday is another article which features Phyllis Coates. Many fans had heard of it, but not many have actually read this extensive article. Another wonderful article is Super Heart in its entirety. George visits Nati Vacio at his school. I’ve scanned entire pages, so the fans get to see it exactly as it was printed.  It’s satisfying to everyone interested. As a result, the collector doesn't have to do a long, exhausting search around the country any more.

EC-How long did it take for you to complete the “Saving George Reeves” CDs?

LK- Both CD presentations took about four months to complete. But remember, it took me years and years to collect all the material contained therein. Since the second CD presentation, I’ve been fortunate to obtain many more great items. Heck, 98% of my purchases on eBay are George Reeves related. As for a third CD, I have no plans to do another one. Like Jim’s assessment of issue 16 of TAC, it doesn’t lend itself to another go at it. I think what the readers are looking for is a book. I’d love to do one, and I have a great idea. I spoke to several people about it and they are absolutely excited by the idea. But again, there are no solid plans at this time nor am I pursuing a publisher. The CDs are like a sampler, speaking for themselves and if someone wants to partner up for a book, I’m listening.

EC-Now with the days of the internet finding photographs is somewhat easier. When you started collecting, how were you able to find some of these rare and hard-to-find photographs? Are these original movie stills?

LK- I started just asking around local memorabilia stores and collectable shows. My first four photos were of the following: Superman shaking hands with the police officer, Superman standing in the freezer (from The Big Freeze), Superman turning towards the camera with the cape bellowed out to the right and one of George Reeves accepting an award from a man. In the last photo, I described George is wearing a traditional dark suit. It’s obviously from the extreme late 50’s since he is wearing his prescription eyeglasses and his hair in thinning. The first three photos would soon turn out to be common, but they are original. Regarding the award photo, something told me I’d better not overlook this.  It turned out be a photo I’ve never seen again and therefore I feel very fortunate I made the right selection over a couple of others which I didn’t buy. I paid thirty dollars for each, which in 1984 was a lot of money. Considering what was available back then, it was very little so well worth it.

EC-Many of these photos are more personal pictures of George with family and friends. Were you surprised that some people were selling these items?

LK- Not really, because a lot of people want to make a couple of dollars or trade to improve their own collections. I’ll never obtain anything without a fair exchange. For the most part everyone I’ve come in contact with, have been great. Unfortunately, I did get hustled a couple of times in the past due to being good natured. But I have no regrets. You win some, you lose some.   Nowadays I'm safe-guarding more of my material to protect the overall collection for a mightier project.

EC-What do you consider some of the highlights that you presented on your “Saving George Reeves” CD?

LK- I'm very proud of an original The Monroe Doctrine photo. It's really a one-of-a-kind black and white photo, but the negative was hand tinted in color. The final result is a gorgeous color print. Also, I became familiar with George's other work outside of Superman from Gary's Superman: Serial to Cereal book. When I found the Monroe Doctrine photo, this kicked off my real interest. It made me realize there is a whole other side of George to explore, with so much more to learn. That's one of the benefits of the Saving George Reeves CD, it's packed with many wonderful photos of George both in and beyond Superman. I think it appeals to both those interested in his full career and as well as the Superman years. Personally, I don't limit myself to just the wonderful Superman years. If you feel there is magic in his Superman performances, you'll find the same beyond the red cape.  By the way, I found the Monroe Doctrine photo in a store on Hollywood Boulevard in June of 1991. It was the last store I went into after coming up empty with several others while looking for George-Superman photos. Someone must have came and cleaned that whole boulevard out! I’ve only seen it again when it appeared in Jan Alan Henderson and Steve Randisi’s book Behind the Crimson Cape in a black and white version.  I know Jan's actual photo is black and white. So what I have is unique.  Another highlight photo is George in the cast photo from Variety Girl. Believe it or not, I found this while searching through a vendor’s magazine box at an outside vintage car show in Pennsylvania. I try to leave no stone unturned, even in odd places like a car show. I also found an incredible 1942 magazine article on Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster that day. The Variety Girl cast photo is probably the only known image of George known to exist from that film. Fans were hard-pressed to spot him in the film itself. I suspect he is at the end when many of the performers walk across the screen. He’s seen at best very faintly in the background.

There are so many highlights on the CDs it really is difficult to not discuss them all, but obviously this interview would take a lot longer!  When I released the CDs, 95% of the items were unique to anything published. Today it still holds up very well, though a little bit here and there has cropped up. I’m proud to present many of those extremely rare articles to give the fans hours of reading enjoyment. And again, the fan response has been great.

EC-I also see you go into detail with other actors/addresses that appeared with George in the movies and television. Did you also look into some of their movie careers?

LK- I thought it would be interesting to acknowledge whom George worked with. It's meant to keep it interesting. Regarding The Monroe Doctrine photo, there you'll find Nanette Fabray. It was only when I referred to imdb.com did it become aware she was the woman in the photo. I was really surprised and excited about it when I learned of it.  

EC-You included numerous articles from movies and newspapers about George Reeves from his early years. Even with the internet, I had a tough time finding the newspaper articles to read about George, especially at the time of his death. How were you able to obtain them?

LK- As I mentioned before, I found many of the newspaper articles on microfiche at a local college. Because the printing from these machines are very substandard, I retyped them word for word as they were originally printed. There are about twenty New York and Los Angeles articles to read in there. Since then I've come across a couple of originals. One I have is an entire June 24, 1959 Los Angeles newspaper with George and the unfortunate headline story. Many other magazine articles were from eBay purchases. I also found some through collectable shows and stores. It takes a lot of patience to go through boxes and boxes of magazines, but it is well worth it.  Then again going by the rule of not to leave any stone unturned, when you least expect it to happen something wonderful pops up. The thrill of the find is amazing. For example, there is an image of George with a little girl on his shoulders at the opening of Disneyland. It is a three by four inch photo, difficult to spot unless you look at each and every photo. There it stood alone in the celebrity’s tidbit section of the magazine. It’s great to find some of these treasures and share them with other fans. I’m still trying to nail down an image of George in a NY newspaper between August and September 1958.

EC-What was the most difficult task you had in trying to complete your project?

LK- I can’t say I had any. I pretty much knew what I wanted to do. I guess it was the grueling effort to retype the newspaper articles. Also, cleaning up some minor water stains from the vintage articles.

EC-When doing your research were you able to denounce a number of rumors that have been going around for years about George to be false?

LK- As a rule, I try not to speculate on any one issue unless I have two or three pieces of information that go with it. It was told Don Brewer had introduced himself to George backstage of Winged Victory in Chicago. This story probably started by someone after hearing only a small detail of the event and assuming how point A got to point B. George was rejected by Don Brewer in 1943 during Winged Victory.  While true on that level, the embellished meeting backstage is untrue. I found out George learned of his natural father while staying with a cousin. When George got to Chicago with Ellanora he phoned Don Brewer living in the Mid-West. During their conversation, Don rejected a relationship with George.  Based on what I learned, I speculated the logical reason was that Don did not want to rock the boat with his current wife, a headstrong woman, by introducing George into the family. My speculation was confirmed by a family member as accurate. George would have been 29 at the time and he was very disturbed by this moment. Gosh, who wouldn’t? 

Then again, we can't always believe everything we read. I have the article where it states George refers to his confrontation with the 8 year old boy aiming his fathers gun at him. We've come to learn that this was not true. But then again, we hear from other people writing on message boards that lived in the Detroit area that seem to recall hearing about this episode in 1954.

EC-Were there any other people who were able to assist you so you could give fans the most accurate information on George Reeves?

LK- I talk to people all the time. For years I have communicated with Jim Nolt, Randy Garrett, Jan Alan Henderson, and Steve Randisi. I have also spoken to Carl Glass. He is in catch-up mode, and making great progress, I will say. He has a great interest and boundless energy as we discuss George at great length. As a result of our conversations, we are exchanging information, thoughts and confirming details for each other. Deciphering what makes logical sense and what doesn’t, and does it hold any value? So I’m sure what we’ve learned from each other has made it into the CD presentations. Certainly just about everyone I know has recognition of inspiration somewhere in there.

EC-I noticed there were a lot of photographs contained in your CD, but there was also a few drawings done by Randy Garrett, illustrator for the Superman and the Secret Planet comic book (which can be seen at www.jimnolt.com).  Were any of these drawings his idea to add to your CD or yours?

LK- First let me say this, the world is a far better place with Randy Garrett in it. He has made so many people from all over the world happy with his rendition of Superman & the Secret Planet. I consider Randy one of my greatest friendships and I'm flat out his biggest fan, bar-none. That's a mighty tall statement considering how well admired he is by The Adventures of Superman community (LOL). He is an ace of a guy. His generosity is rarely matched. Just look at Superman & the Secret Planet and other work he has done on the TAC website.

The two illustrations Randy did for me were ideas of my own, inspired from something else. His skills as an illustrator can catch lightning in a bottle as far as I'm concerned. It’s amazing to have the talent to layout and pencil an illustration, but look close at the inking. His embellishes and colorings are just so wonderfully rendered. He is a complete craftsman.  He recreated the cover of Superman #16 with the likeness of Noel and George. This image has traveled around in my head ever since I laid eyes on that issue. (Which, by the way, I own an original copy.) The other image is of George revisiting the Mole Men in 1953. The image came to me when I saw the film Toy Story. Do you remember the scene where Buzz Lightyear falls into the game occupied by little green people? Right then, I saw George and the Mole Men. I gave Randy the idea and he did a tremendous job. Then again when doesn't he do a great job? The TAC web-site, 16 issues of the fanzine and the two calendars he and Jim produced are graced with tons of his wonderful illustrations. No one could have done what Randy unselfishly has done. He illustrated Noel and George in the Nash-Healy for me to perfection. I gave him a very rough sketch, a little written text detail of how I envisioned Noel and George and the imagination became a reality. As far as I'm concerned he is a great part of the extended history of the Adventures of Superman. You can’t give a history lesson on this show without including Randy’s Secret Planet.    

EC-Now that the movie “Hollywoodland” came out, do you think there will be new or renewed interest on the life and times of George Reeves?

LK- Oh sure. Look at the prices Speeding Bullet and Hollywood Kryptonite were selling for on eBay recently. Speeding Bullet got over two hundred dollars. It is really amazing how people are racing to read this subject. Thankfully, Jan decided to print a second updated version to answer the demand.  Both Carl Glass of Glass House Presents and I have seen a rise in the interest in e-mails alone. I responded to probably a hundred e-mails in September because of Hollywoodland. It was exhausting. Tracking on Readyhost.com, both TAC and GHP saw a huge spike in hits during September ‘06. To help with my responses, I wrote Flight of the Innocent, my Hollywoodland - historical counter-essay. It made it a lot easier to communicate overall. I think it helped Carl too. He and I pretty much agree a lot on this subject. While the essay helps with the abundance of the topic, I still enjoy a focused e-mail discussion on any of the issues. There are so many great people out there that have had this interest for so long and many new people are writing all the time with fond memories of George and the rest of the Adventures of Superman cast.

George left an everlasting positive effect on his fans. Something the newspaper media fails to understand. They don’t see George has a caring following and regardless of the true circumstances of his death, we admire him just the same because we believe the way he treated people as equals, the things he did in life to help others, and his career are fascinating traits. If idolizing him for raising hundreds of thousands of dollars, a tremendous amount of money in those days, visiting children in cancer wards with no agenda for publicity means we are hero worshipping, well then so be it...I’m guilty as charged. He is my hero, not for saving Lois Lane and Jimmy Olsen 104 times, but for living up to the same qualities that Superman a hero. We know he couldn't save the world in real life, but he did his part.  A positive role model? Absolutely. I see the real man and so do many others. These are good qualities to admire. As Mr. Larson has said, “George  gave away more money to out-of-work actors than was ever paid back to him.” George was admired greatly in his time and still is today. Just ask, Bette Shayne, Stephanie Shayne, Fred Crane, Dabbs Greer. In real life, he did have faults, but I believe these lapses are very much over-embellished and treated like he was the only one who ever lifted a martini glass. It was the times and the place.

It’s funny. If you characterize George as nothing but being a good man, you’ll be labeled a "blind hero worshipping fan boy." Reflect on his social drinking, female relationships and you will fall into the clutches of idolizing a selfish bum.

For example, George has been defined as a “womanizer.” Has any woman ever come forward as a jilted lover? Not that I’ve ever heard of.  So “womanizer” seems a little harsh. I was sitting in the Kenneth Hahn Hall on July 10, 2001 next to Joanne Siegel her daughter Laura Siegel-Larson (both very nice people). We attended the 50^th Anniversary of the 1951 filming of the Superman TV show. While chatting, she told me of a story of meeting George before she was married and long before he became Superman. She was working in a Los Angeles nightclub and he introduced himself, asked her what time she got off work and would she be interested in going out dancing? She said they went out together and he was wonderfully charming and every bit the gentlemen. Her story is also told recently in the Feb. 2006 magazine issue of Alter Ego, by Roy Thomas.

In the 40’s, George had tried the "all-American traditional marriage" with Ellanora. They were married for approximately eight years and unfortunately it didn't work out. Ellanora was his true love. While they tried, they weren't successful in producing a child of their own. I have a strong belief George was sterile. This may be one reason why their marriage didn't succeed. George, as we know, was a sensitive and considerate man and may not have wanted to face disappointing another woman wanting to start a family. As for Toni or Leonore, I doubt George saw either as candidates for motherhood. Thus, he found a safe haven from a possible disappointing situation. We also know from Alejandro Vacio, Nati (his lifelong best friend) and Queta's son that George would have loved a child of his own.  Wanting to be part of a family, George asked Alejandro to call him “Uncle Jorge.” 

EC-Is there any other project you might be interested in or like seeing in the future as it pertains to allowing fans to know more about George Reeves?

LK- Can we expect to see more? First, I want to say any well-done book on George is always great. There have been some really great books out there over the years. Most recently, Peter Murano’s The George Reeves Adventures of Superman Companion Book which was a wonderful surprise. Jan Alan Henderson, Steve Randisi and Mike Bifulco Behind The Crimson Cape: The Cinema of George Reeves was great to read and backed with amazing photos. I was happy to be a small contributor to that, as well as Jan’s second edition to Speeding Bullet. Larry Ward’s second edition of Truth, Justice and the American Way: The Life and Times of Noel Neill, The Original Lois Lane was another bright spot this year. And everyone got into the spotlight in that one. I don’t want to leave out Mike Bifulco’s Tenth Anniversary Edition of Superman on Television and Spaceman Lost. These are all very tough acts to follow. I know each of these individuals and I know the hard work each put into these projects. Hopefully, there’s more to come.

At the Chiller Theatre show in East Rutherford, New Jersey, I witnessed fans line up to see the sweetheart of America’s favorite superhero. Fans old and new crowded Conference Room A of the Sheraton Hotel to see the original Lois Lane, Noel Neill. There were other comic book artists and television actors/actresses nearby, but fans lined up to see Noel. They were there to hear her stories and/or have a picture taken with the icon they watched time and time again. They watched her get saved by Superman, who was played by the unforgettable George Reeves, the one who many consider their favorite Man of Steel.

When you entered the conference room you immediately saw a big picture of George Reeves dressed as Superman with Noel together in a publicity shot which had been taken years ago. Alongside this picture was a poster stating in bold letters that Noel Neill is the Original Lois Lane.  Then, standing by the table, as big as life, was Ms. Noel Neill. She was there waiting to greet you with a warm smile and wearing a blue shirt with that famous “S” symbol on it. Displayed on her table were various pictures of her in different episodes of The Adventures of Superman, along with other motion pictures including the two Superman serials she appeared in.

As the fans came to see her, I saw that many were middle-aged men and women approaching her with wide smiles.  Some came to have pictures signed that they had previously taken with Ms. Neill, their favorite television reporter. As they approached her, they had a gleam in their eye. As they greeted Ms. Neill, many fans told her that The Adventures of Superman television series was their show while growing up and how it impacted in their life. As the younger generation came to see Ms. Neill, some were surprised to find out that Christopher Reeve was not the first one to don that famous crimson cape. They learned that there were others that flew through the skies of Metropolis on the big screen and television before they were born.

As fans were coming in many of them stated that they drove for miles not to see the other thirty plus actors/actresses/comic book artists in attendance at Chiller, but to see only one person, Ms. Noel Neill. Fans were telling her stories about how they used to rush home after school so they could see The Adventures of Superman on television. They proudly admitted that years later they continued to see the show whenever it aired on television.

I saw many adults leading their children and grandchildren to the room and telling them that this was the person they grew up with and watched for so many years on television. They also told stated that George and Noel were their Superman and Lois Lane, and there is no one that could ever replace them in their heart.

In addition to having a personalized autograph picture(s) of Ms. Neill, She gladly posed with fans and had her picture taken over and over again. I watched adults feel like children again as they took a picture with her. They thanked her for giving them memories they can share with their children and grandchildren. They also told stories of how they felt as a kid waiting for George to change to that famous costume that so many of us have duplicated in our own unique way.  There was one individual who was so excited that he finally had the chance to meet Ms. Neill that he almost forgot his autographed picture that she signed for him. He told her that he waited years for this opportunity to come, and he was not going to miss it for the world. He left with a tear in his eye saying that her show meant so much to him. He thanked her over and over again, as did many other fans, for giving them memories they would never forgot.